Watch this dog FIND - a hunter in Scent Lok
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Boy, you really have it out for Scent Lok!
Other studies by scientists using "search & rescue dogs" in Coloraod, found that the dogs found all 43 hunters, whether they wre using activated carbon clogthing or not.
And it took the dogs an average of 17 seconds more to find the hunters in carbon - not much differencce.
Scent Lok does not work - as advertised ... it is a scam!
And it took the dogs an average of 17 seconds more to find the hunters in carbon - not much differencce.
Scent Lok does not work - as advertised ... it is a scam!
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5,871 Posts
I believe coyotes have twice the nose of a whitetail. So I would assume a dog breed bred to have a nose would be better than a deer.
Im with TR, ive always thought it was a sham. But if a guys willing to spend $200 on camo, have at it.
Im with TR, ive always thought it was a sham. But if a guys willing to spend $200 on camo, have at it.
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How do we know it's really a guy wearing Scentlock and not just you out there in camo?TRMichels said:
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I wear scentlock base layers and a scent lock camo pants and shirt. I also took a shower in the scent soaps and what not. carried all my clothes to the field in a scent lock bag. Got dressed and walked to a stand.
Well my test was last night. I had a buck come in down wind of me. 10 yards. Stayed around me for 30 mins. Yep it came in from the wrong side and did not detect me.
So I think it works. Even if it doesn't it gives me confidence when setting up a stand. Just my two pennies.
Well my test was last night. I had a buck come in down wind of me. 10 yards. Stayed around me for 30 mins. Yep it came in from the wrong side and did not detect me.
So I think it works. Even if it doesn't it gives me confidence when setting up a stand. Just my two pennies.
Do activated carbon suits fool the nose?
Scent Lok has claimed that their suits remove enough human perspiration odors from a person wearing their suits that deer cannot smell a person wearing their suits. They have also claimed that deer smell better than dogs.
Research shows that deer have up to 297 million olfactory receptors in the nose, plus a vomeronasal organ (that detects scents/odors) in the room of their mouth. Dogs have up to 220 million olfactory receptors in the nose, plus a vomeronasal organ. Humans have up to 5 million olfactory receptors in the nose, but no vomeronasal organ.
If the number of olfactory receptors in the nose of an animal is any indication of its ability to detect scents, then deer have a better sense of smell than dogs, and could have detected the humans wearing activated carbon suits in the Shivik study.
In a test with search dogs, by JA Shivik, Ph.D., forty-two people were hidden from Colorado search and rescue dogs. Twenty-one of the people wore activated carbon suits; twenty-one did not. The dogs found all twenty-one people who didn't wear activated carbon suits, and twenty of the people who wore activated carbon suits. There was no noticeable difference in the time it took the dogs to find the humans. It took the dogs 2.7 minutes to detect the humans who were not wearing activated carbon suits, and 3.4 minutes to find the humans who were wearing activated carbon suits.
Shivik's report states, "That the dogs detected humans wearing the suit indicates that the system failed to prevent detection of human odors." Since deer have a sense of smell equal to if not better than dogs, it is safe to assume that deer would have detected the humans too.
The report adds, "The suits are probably not worth the cost to researchers or managers who want to approach canids undetected." They probably aren't worth $150 to $300 to hunters either, if they can't keep deer from detecting the hunters. You can view this article at this address http://www.aphis.usda.gov/ws/nwrc/is/annpub2002.html, by scrolling down to report number "02-93 Shivik" and downloading the PDF file.
They do not work>>>>
I'll bet you took other precautions too - like showirng etc, before you hunted.
You probably would have had the bucks nearby without the suit.
Scent Lok has claimed that their suits remove enough human perspiration odors from a person wearing their suits that deer cannot smell a person wearing their suits. They have also claimed that deer smell better than dogs.
Research shows that deer have up to 297 million olfactory receptors in the nose, plus a vomeronasal organ (that detects scents/odors) in the room of their mouth. Dogs have up to 220 million olfactory receptors in the nose, plus a vomeronasal organ. Humans have up to 5 million olfactory receptors in the nose, but no vomeronasal organ.
If the number of olfactory receptors in the nose of an animal is any indication of its ability to detect scents, then deer have a better sense of smell than dogs, and could have detected the humans wearing activated carbon suits in the Shivik study.
In a test with search dogs, by JA Shivik, Ph.D., forty-two people were hidden from Colorado search and rescue dogs. Twenty-one of the people wore activated carbon suits; twenty-one did not. The dogs found all twenty-one people who didn't wear activated carbon suits, and twenty of the people who wore activated carbon suits. There was no noticeable difference in the time it took the dogs to find the humans. It took the dogs 2.7 minutes to detect the humans who were not wearing activated carbon suits, and 3.4 minutes to find the humans who were wearing activated carbon suits.
Shivik's report states, "That the dogs detected humans wearing the suit indicates that the system failed to prevent detection of human odors." Since deer have a sense of smell equal to if not better than dogs, it is safe to assume that deer would have detected the humans too.
The report adds, "The suits are probably not worth the cost to researchers or managers who want to approach canids undetected." They probably aren't worth $150 to $300 to hunters either, if they can't keep deer from detecting the hunters. You can view this article at this address http://www.aphis.usda.gov/ws/nwrc/is/annpub2002.html, by scrolling down to report number "02-93 Shivik" and downloading the PDF file.
They do not work>>>>
I'll bet you took other precautions too - like showirng etc, before you hunted.
You probably would have had the bucks nearby without the suit.
I just don't see how it CAN work... if the charcoal is soaking up human odor, it's soaking up ALL airborne organic compounds. It's not like it can differentiate. Even if it is able to be re-generated (which I also doubt), it would be saturated pretty quickly. It's also not like the charcoal is everywhere. The fabric is permeable, and there's no way to ensure that any particular escaping scent molecule is intercepted by carbon, and your body is constantly producing scent. On layers that are close to the skin. You're getting sweat in plenty of places where the carbon isn't.
I do believe in many of the scent killing products, but only so far as making sure that the clothing itself doesn't reek. Scent is going to take a while to diffuse out of any fabric... which explains the dreaded "Dutch Oven".
There is plenty of anecdotal evidence to say it works, but there is just as much, if not more evidence of deer that couldn't care less. My mother in law had a NICE buck walk DIRECTLY under her stand last year, and she reeked of Downy.
I do believe in many of the scent killing products, but only so far as making sure that the clothing itself doesn't reek. Scent is going to take a while to diffuse out of any fabric... which explains the dreaded "Dutch Oven".
There is plenty of anecdotal evidence to say it works, but there is just as much, if not more evidence of deer that couldn't care less. My mother in law had a NICE buck walk DIRECTLY under her stand last year, and she reeked of Downy.
Actually Scent lok does diminish human scent to a point the deer know a human was there but with reduced scent may think the human has passed through the area and is not still there. That is what I have found, it is not 100% but does help reduce human scent.
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hey guys geuss what. i'm gunna go jump a roost tonite!!
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Ive had the same thing happen without scent lok. Which leads me to believe its a sham.Chuck Smith said:
But if it gives you confidence, it gives you confidence, and you cant argue with that.
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Ditto what barebackjack said.
Good luck with your case, TR. My take on it is it will be an uphill battle. I doubt whether a deer can detect you or not will be the determining factor. I believe you will have to prove charcoal does NOT absorb odor, and I think we all know that it does. I also think the studies you've posted confirm that...albeit on a very small scale. The only person NOT found was the one wearing scentlok, and it did take longer to find the ones that were found.
I've always been of the opinion you can NEVER prevent or eliminate ALL human scent. The guy in the video had a jacket over his pants. Heated air from under the clothing makes it's way out at the waist, neck and face, ankles/kness. etc., even if the charcoal was re-activated just minutes before the test. So even if we falsely assume the charcoal layer absorbed ALL scent that came through it, it would do nothing for the scent that sifted out at the waist, etc.
I wear it until it gets real cold. For the same reason I do many things that some would consider anal....because a lot of tiny details can add up to a big deer on the wall, and saving $100 on clothes that will last me for 10 years or more is not where I feel the need to cut corners.
But having said all that...I use skunk screen. If I can smell it..I KNOW THE DEER CAN, and it works almost flawlessly. Like I said, I don't believe in scent elimination but believe very strongly in COVER scent. I have had deer downwind of me every night this week, at distances as close as the base of my tree on 3 occasions, and none showed any signs of detection.
I would try to settle out of Court. :wink:
Please keep us informed of the progress.
:beer:
I've always been of the opinion you can NEVER prevent or eliminate ALL human scent. The guy in the video had a jacket over his pants. Heated air from under the clothing makes it's way out at the waist, neck and face, ankles/kness. etc., even if the charcoal was re-activated just minutes before the test. So even if we falsely assume the charcoal layer absorbed ALL scent that came through it, it would do nothing for the scent that sifted out at the waist, etc.
I wear it until it gets real cold. For the same reason I do many things that some would consider anal....because a lot of tiny details can add up to a big deer on the wall, and saving $100 on clothes that will last me for 10 years or more is not where I feel the need to cut corners.
But having said all that...I use skunk screen. If I can smell it..I KNOW THE DEER CAN, and it works almost flawlessly. Like I said, I don't believe in scent elimination but believe very strongly in COVER scent. I have had deer downwind of me every night this week, at distances as close as the base of my tree on 3 occasions, and none showed any signs of detection.
I would try to settle out of Court. :wink:
Please keep us informed of the progress.
:beer:
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Hey!
Whatever happened with the lawsuit against Scent lok saying that the temperatures of the reactivation of the carbon couldn't be achieved in your ordinary run of the mill dryer? Did anything pan out or is this still in progress?
Whatever happened with the lawsuit against Scent lok saying that the temperatures of the reactivation of the carbon couldn't be achieved in your ordinary run of the mill dryer? Did anything pan out or is this still in progress?
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353 Posts
I had one pair of sentlok gloves till they wore out.
I say to each his own. If it works for you then go for it.
If it don't then leave it.
either way what does it matter to someone else. not me.
I don't personally use the stuff. but I'm not gonna tell you you cant use it.
maybe it is just someones way of trying to make it better for hunters and trying to make a little bill money. either way they're not holding a gun to your head saying use it or die.
let it go move on. and enjoy it if you choose. or not.
just don't hold the gun to our heads because we think differently than you.
I say to each his own. If it works for you then go for it.
If it don't then leave it.
either way what does it matter to someone else. not me.
I don't personally use the stuff. but I'm not gonna tell you you cant use it.
maybe it is just someones way of trying to make it better for hunters and trying to make a little bill money. either way they're not holding a gun to your head saying use it or die.
let it go move on. and enjoy it if you choose. or not.
just don't hold the gun to our heads because we think differently than you.
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Scent dogs are bred to find humans and follow a scent trail that they have left behind. deer aren't LOOKING for human scent they are just passing through an area where the scent is (or was) if the study wanted to be truthful to advertising they would have used REAL DEER!!!!! not dogs. comparing two seperate species in two seperate situations will give you two seperate outcomes. people will read and use data from "studies" to tell you what ever you want to hear. that is why companies do research and have a research and advertisement depts. if i tell you that i catch all of my fish only with just a worm and hook and that those other lures don't work better even though i only use worm and hook. people will believe that because i have results. All of MY fish are caught with worm and hook doesn't mean the others don't work. JMTC
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