Gun Control????

Some other things to think about or discuss...

Who do we as a society blame when someone drinks 12 beers, gets into a vehicle and drives home? Then they kill someone. Do we blame the Car? Beer? Or the idiot who CHOOSES TO DRIVE. If it was the "gun abolish" crowd's logic you blame the beer or the car. Beer is too easily accessed, need a license/background check to buy beer, etc. Then you will hear them say... WELL YOU ARE LICENSED TO DRIVE... Correct. Think of what a driver's license does or the course you have to take to get a drivers license. It teaches you to drive a car, the laws of operation of a car, and then you pass a test on using the car to show you can physically do it. Well what will a "gun" license do? Show that you can shoot a gun, use it correctly? Shows you know the "laws" of not to kill someone or point a gun at people? Do you think if someone wants to go and hurt others that having a license will "stop" this. NOPE. Just like when you get licensed to drive a car you have to go thru a whole chapter about DRUNK DRIVING... but is that stopping people from DRIVING DRUNK......NOPE!!!!

I mean these "shootings" are not accidents because they are not thinking gun safety? Or don't know that killing someone is wrong.

So honestly what will the "licensing" to own a gun actually do?? NOTHING. I know people will say...well you need a background check to get a "license"... OK... see my above post about how we do go thru a background check and that the NICS is back logged because they are not funded and that some records can't be accessed because of LAWS.

Now something else to consider that isn't getting talked about. Video games and also other "games"...ie: Air Soft. You know where people dress up all "tactical" and go shoot BB style soft ammunition/rounds at each other. But onto the video games.... they are very very life like. Amazing graphics and detailed. NOW I AM NOT BLAMING THESE GAMES AT ALL. But those games teach tactics and what not. Also gun manufacturers are making more guns that look like the guns in the games. Look at all the "precision" type rifles now on the market. Before if you want them you need to order all the parts yourself or talk with a gunsmith to custom build those guns. Now Savage, Ruger, etc make them and distribute them to your local Scheels. It is all marketing to the "gamer" crowed.

Again I am not blaming gun manufacturers or video games or Air soft. But it is things that need to be honestly talked about with what is all going on. I mean when I was growing up in the late 80's and 90's and 00's. The graphics and video games were not like today. You had your mario cart, football, a few "war" type games. But nothing like today and what not. Plus look on youtube and you can see alot of people shooting many (IMHO) cool guns...ie: AK's, AR's, M4's, Barretts, full auto, etc. So there is more exposure to these types of weapons and wanting to shoot them. I KNOW I DO.

Again... this is things that need to be discussed when talking all about gun issues. Let alone mental health, lack of supervision, lack of father/mothers, bullying, mental wellness, possible drugs (prescribed) people are on, lack of faith, etc.

Also to any crowed about BANNING... how did that go for drugs, Alcohol (remember prohibition), etc. How is the "war on drugs" going? I am sure the same people who are saying BAN ALL GUNS or even BAN AR'S are the same that want legalization for Pot. Now I dont need to go into that completely. But if people say "pot never killed anyone"... WRONG.. Why did cartel's have wars? As dealers if they been shot at or violence against them for selling in the wrong area? Yeah the users might not have died... but POT has alot of blood on its hands... even now when it is legal in many areas..... Still cartels and dealers selling illegally. Just saying. Wont even talk about Fentanyl and opioids. But you get my point.

Plus those are not protected by the 2A.

But just things to think about and discuss. Love to hear any feed back at all.

When Cain killed Abel God didn't ban rocks.

We don't have a gun problem, we have a culture problem. Have you ever noticed the people who want to ban guns have very bad tempers. Perhaps they can imagine killing someone. They shoukd take personal responsibility and never own a gun. However they shoukd not force a ban on reasonable cool headed people who woukd never want hurt anyone.
Driving a car is an privilege, but owning a gun is a right. Its reasonable to require a license to drive, but I couldn't support anything like that for guns. I dont remember the time requirement, but the FBI is required to destroy information on your gun purchase within something like three months. Years ago we heard they kept all information illegally and we already have a facsimile of gun registration. I still have boxes in the rafters of my garage with serial numbers of guns I sold 20 years ago. That woukd drive them nuts.

Politicians calling for gun control don't want to stop school shooting. they are dictator wannabes who want a disarmed society helpless as they go off the deep end. Never trust anyone for gun control. When they say "reasonable" who determins what's reasonable, them? They are all a bunch of Karen's.

I dont think a kid who plays games like Call of Duty a half hour a day will have problems, but I do think parents who use these games as baby sitters four to five hours a day are going to have calouse children.

I think Chuck is spot on with how the 40 billion we sent the Ukrain should have been used.

The problem with society started when the same liberals who want gun control threw God out of our schools. They created the problem. but have no idea how to solve it.

Roman's 1:28 explains liberals.

And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done.
Romans 1:28 ESV


Unfortunately for the freedom of our republic there is no shortage of Republicans that are fools, and think they can be more acceptable if they go along with gun control.

Speaking of twisted liberals: we can all agree killing a 10 year old is insane, but somehow liberals think killing the even more defenseless in the birth canal is ok.

Chuck Smith said:

So with the shooting that just happened in TX and Buffalo we will be hearing all summer pre-election about gun control.

Even though as facts are coming out about these two shootings is just crazy.

• The response of the TX PD
• The shooter in Buf chose the area because of "gun laws" on books
• School safety and protocols that were ignored or didn't happen...
• etc.

But here are some things to think about and some possible solutions.

1. We sent $40B to Ukraine to ARM THEMSELVES. That money could have went to schools for updated safety features. These features contrary to "RADICAL" left would make schools "prisons" at all. BTW... There is about 100K public schools in the USA... that $40B would have been about $400K to each of these schools to upgrade things I will talk about. And these things are not some SCFI state of the art. Think of safe home offered by Alexa.

- Single point entry when students are present. You have them for apartment buildings, office complex's, etc. You know you do in one door then have to get BUZZED into the building to get into another door. Put a camera there. Not that hard or overly expensive to do.

- Alarms on any doors that are locked and get opened from the inside. I have two "alarms" on my office doors that cost me $20 and they give an BUZZZ so I know if people come into those doors. My office is in the back and I can always see if people come in one of the doors. SIMPLE... Have this "alarm" go to the office of the school. Where a secretary or anyone can see if a door is opened. With WIFI not that expensive or hard to do.

- Shatter/bullet proof glass at entrances and doors (think sandy hook guy shot out plain double pane glass). This is proven to help and slow people it all down so others can get out the other doors. Again... Alarm type system on it when glass breaks that alerts a central point. THis would be the most expensive.

- LOCK THE DOORS so that nobody from the outside can get in. yeah... that is how this idiot got into the building...an unlocked back door.

So there is simple solutions to help prevent things like this from happening. THAT IS IF THE SCHOOL FOLLOWS THRU.

Now onto the "gun" control. Topic. Since this is a hunting site most of us are very pro 2A.

You hear liberals scream... COMMON SENSE laws. Well we have a ton of laws on the books and many do conflict with each other. You know like mental health records and sharing of juvenal records and what not. The backlogs of agents on NICS checks for firearms and what not. So there are laws on the books that actually hurt background checks. But that is something they dont want to talk about. OR the laws that help keep firearms out of felons hands but courts DROP those charges or "gun" charges ASAP or plea stuff down. Instead of hammering people to the fullest extent of the law. I know all of this costs MONEY. But all we hear about is DEFUND POLICE.... FBI IS HORRIBLE... ETC. So yeah you have that problem as well.

But in MN to purchase an AR or Handgun you need to have something called a purchase permit. IT IS FREE OF CHARGE. All you do is go to your local Chief of police or city hall and fill out the permit. They have 7 days to either accept or deny the permit. What this does or supposed to do is go thru a little more "thorough" background check. The permit is good for 1 year. You take this permit up to any store and show it to them and get your gone that same day. SIMPLE. Also if you have a Carry and Conceal permit... it acts just like this Purchase permit. Again this is FREE OF CHARGE. It is for purchasing an AR or a Handgun.

This is honestly something I can get behind. It really isn't that big of an inconvenience unless you forget that it expired. Which I have done... but then the store just holds the gun for me with a little "down payment" and I am back 7 days later to pick it up.

So anyone else care for discussion? Also can always be talking points when you discuss with others outside of this forum.

Here is an EDIT: I forgot to add in some literature about the permit I was talking about.

Click to expand...

Chuck Smith said:

So with the shooting that just happened in TX and Buffalo we will be hearing all summer pre-election about gun control.

Even though as facts are coming out about these two shootings is just crazy.

• The response of the TX PD
• The shooter in Buf chose the area because of "gun laws" on books
• School safety and protocols that were ignored or didn't happen...
• etc.

But here are some things to think about and some possible solutions.

1. We sent $40B to Ukraine to ARM THEMSELVES. That money could have went to schools for updated safety features. These features contrary to "RADICAL" left would make schools "prisons" at all. BTW... There is about 100K public schools in the USA... that $40B would have been about $400K to each of these schools to upgrade things I will talk about. And these things are not some SCFI state of the art. Think of safe home offered by Alexa.

- Single point entry when students are present. You have them for apartment buildings, office complex's, etc. You know you do in one door then have to get BUZZED into the building to get into another door. Put a camera there. Not that hard or overly expensive to do.

- Alarms on any doors that are locked and get opened from the inside. I have two "alarms" on my office doors that cost me $20 and they give an BUZZZ so I know if people come into those doors. My office is in the back and I can always see if people come in one of the doors. SIMPLE... Have this "alarm" go to the office of the school. Where a secretary or anyone can see if a door is opened. With WIFI not that expensive or hard to do.

- Shatter/bullet proof glass at entrances and doors (think sandy hook guy shot out plain double pane glass). This is proven to help and slow people it all down so others can get out the other doors. Again... Alarm type system on it when glass breaks that alerts a central point. THis would be the most expensive.

- LOCK THE DOORS so that nobody from the outside can get in. yeah... that is how this idiot got into the building...an unlocked back door.

So there is simple solutions to help prevent things like this from happening. THAT IS IF THE SCHOOL FOLLOWS THRU.

Now onto the "gun" control. Topic. Since this is a hunting site most of us are very pro 2A.

You hear liberals scream... COMMON SENSE laws. Well we have a ton of laws on the books and many do conflict with each other. You know like mental health records and sharing of juvenal records and what not. The backlogs of agents on NICS checks for firearms and what not. So there are laws on the books that actually hurt background checks. But that is something they dont want to talk about. OR the laws that help keep firearms out of felons hands but courts DROP those charges or "gun" charges ASAP or plea stuff down. Instead of hammering people to the fullest extent of the law. I know all of this costs MONEY. But all we hear about is DEFUND POLICE.... FBI IS HORRIBLE... ETC. So yeah you have that problem as well.

But in MN to purchase an AR or Handgun you need to have something called a purchase permit. IT IS FREE OF CHARGE. All you do is go to your local Chief of police or city hall and fill out the permit. They have 7 days to either accept or deny the permit. What this does or supposed to do is go thru a little more "thorough" background check. The permit is good for 1 year. You take this permit up to any store and show it to them and get your gone that same day. SIMPLE. Also if you have a Carry and Conceal permit... it acts just like this Purchase permit. Again this is FREE OF CHARGE. It is for purchasing an AR or a Handgun.

This is honestly something I can get behind. It really isn't that big of an inconvenience unless you forget that it expired. Which I have done... but then the store just holds the gun for me with a little "down payment" and I am back 7 days later to pick it up.

So anyone else care for discussion? Also can always be talking points when you discuss with others outside of this forum.

Here is an EDIT: I forgot to add in some literature about the permit I was talking about.

Click to expand...

The police acted in reverse of every active shooter training curriculum ever conducted. The lessons of Beslan and Mumbai were thoroughly studied and war gamed.

The response is clear and simple. The first good guy on scene engages the bad guy, or he keeps killing as rapidly as possible. This is done without backup if necessary and with what you are currently carrying, no delays to "armor up" or to grab more firepower. Every second of delay kills more innocents.

It's probably a suicide mission, your only goal is to stop the killing for as long as possible, so other good guys with guns can arrive and continue the engagement until the terrorists is put down.

The actions of that police department is clear, they WANTED as much death as possible. Thereby assisting the call to disarm the law abiding. This is political, it was calculated, and it was allowed to happen. Every cop in that unit needs to immediately loose their peace officer certificates. Cowards and political operatives are not needed. Then they should be sent to some place where real men with guns can shoot at them.

This guy is spot on.



The Mass Shooting and Liberal Utopian Society

Written by: Pastor Andrew Isker



In the last two weeks, there have been two mass shootings in the United States, and the second took place this week at an elementary school in Uvalde, Texas. These shootings have reignited the regime’s already intense desire for a disarmed populace. Even before the bodies of the dead children had been removed from the school, our mentally diminished President spoke to the nation, demanding that rifles (which he is not even able to accurately describe) be confiscated across a 330 million person country spanning an entire continent.
This despicable man, and the legion of sociopathic ghouls arrayed behind him, are clearly overjoyed that there is a classroom full of young children lying dead in Texas. They don’t actually care about the anguish of parents who will never see their child grow up. Their deaths are merely a political prop for the most evil people on the planet.
It is hard to fully comprehend just how totalitarian such designs are. But these are the very same sadistic freaks who successfully locked those 330 million people in their homes for weeks or months, and then (mostly successfully) restricted their ability to provide for their families if they refused to get an extremely dangerous mRNA injection that does not even accomplish its intended purpose. All you are to them is a guinea pig or a rat in a social experiment. You do not matter. Your children do not matter. You only exist to provide them with power.
You must understand that school shooters and other mass shooters are an extremely acute symptom of the disease that horribly afflicts the American nation. You live in an incredibly sick society, and since you are born into it and live in it every day, you go about your life mostly unaware of just how dreadful things really are. It is imperative for the people who manufacture the inversion of reality that you perceive everything through the lens of the now.
This is why “The Current Thing” has such memetic power: it attacks reality distortion at its source, where obsession over what is, right now, cuts you off from any sense of historical perspective. In the case of mass shootings, the exclusion of historical perspective keeps the masses from noticing that mass shootings are a very recent phenomenon and that decades ago, when the United States had vastly more liberal gun laws, and anyone could even purchase fully automatic submachine guns in the mail, this never happened. The question you should ask is, why not? What exactly was different about America 90 years ago compared to today?
The answer to that question is fairly obvious. Modern American society is a factory for psychopaths. The young man in the North American Continent is planted in a field fertilized by atomization, loneliness, and hopelessness. Many have never met their father, and most do not have anything remotely close to a “good relationship” with him. Most have no meaningful connection to the community in which they live, nor even the nation they inhabit. In school, they are social outcasts, driven to niche internet communities for the only semblance of human interaction in their lives. They are marinated in hardcore pornography from before they have even reached pubescence.
They know (or at least perceive) that they will never know the love of a flesh-and-blood woman. They are on the kind of pharmacological cocktail that any premodern society would only ascribe to witchcraft and demon possession. They have nothing to live for and no one who loves them. Given how many young men our nation is producing like this, the question we ought to be asking is not “why does this happen?” but rather “why does it not happen a lot more?”
America is an incredibly sick nation. There is a spiritual sickness that pervades everything like a dark cloud. The people who dominate every institution in our nation have held this power for at least sixty years. For these sixty years, they have treated this nation as a grand social experiment. They have made the natural family, the very bedrock of human civilization, an antiquated, outdated institution that we have progressed beyond.
They have financialized and commodified all of human life, uprooting people from their homes and extended families, and making them mercenaries chasing after a rapidly devalued dollar. They have exported the industry of the nation impoverishing the heartland of the country and leaving them to languish in despair. They actively cheer the deaths and replacement of the hated population, while at the same time denying this was ever their intent. They have introduced racial and ethnic strife, and in the chaos actively undermined rule of law. Sixty years of full-spectrum control by utopian social engineers have transformed the most affluent society in human history into hell on earth.
This did not happen by accident. These people are motivated by a deep hatred of humanity. Like the geriatric that currently occupies the Oval Office who well represents them, they simply do not care how much people suffer. You might think the progressive is merely mistaken, deluded by ideology. This is not the case. They have had more than sixty years to see the full extent of human misery their ideology produces when applied to the healthiest and most prosperous conditions. They know what they are doing.
But what is to be done? The utopian bugmen that dominate our nation must be overcome. You must personally re-capture the same spirit of Christian America that built a great nation. You must do all within your personal sphere of influence to rebuild the things that our enemies have destroyed. You must rebuild churches dominated by liberals and weak-willed conservatives. You must rebuild neighborhoods and communities with people who, like you, love the nation that their great, great-grandparents built and who want to worship the same God who gave them such strength.
You must devote your life to both retaking what institutions you can, and creating alternatives for the institutions you can’t. It is not simply enough to decry that the libs have ruined everything—of course they have, they are like cancer! You must have a vision for your people, you must provide for them the thing they have taken away: hope for the future. We can again have the world that the liberal globalist regime has destroyed. A world where the fear of the Triune God pervades the land and not hopelessness and despair. You can have a world where things like mass shootings never happen again, but you must devote yourself to a life of repentance, faith, and an unquenchable passion for the true, good, and beautiful things God has given

Canuck....

I am trying... I have emailed each one of my "representatives" from my state and told them just what I stated on here. About how the $40B sent to the Ukraine could have went towards a "safe" school. Also how that it wouldn't make the schools a "prison" like many say. I mentioned that apartment buildings are like this for safety, business offices, airports, etc. WHY CANT SCHOOLS. I didn't mention one thing about metal detectors. I talked about how many of the shootings that have happened people gained access from either unlocked doors or doors not outfitted with the safety precautions that are needed.

Then I mentioned like I did here. Again not blaming any games or gamers at all. But those games are so life like that it could be desensitizing kids and also showing tactics or how to be "tactical". This I tried to lead into mental health and mental health issues.

But we will see if it falls on deaf ears. Because All I got back was a "form" letter.

But who knows. Trying the process and see if they listen. But then like plainsman... VOTING is how we can do things.

I am going to preface this by saying that even one child, or person for that matter being killed in a mass shooting is a tragedy.

But, for a little perspective, from 1982 to 2021 there were 123 mass shootings, 952 people were killed. (Time magazine) According to the USDOT an average of 40,000 people are killed each year in traffic accidents, and according to John Hopkins Medical 250,000 people die each year due to medical malpractice, that's PER YEAR.

Why is the mainstream media not hammering this? Why do we hear only of gun control?

The short answer is, because the liberal democrats and their propaganda arm (mainstream media) desperately want to disarm the American people. Total government control can't happen with an armed citizenry. The end game here is the elimination of every single firearm in this country except for those in government control. They realize that this will not happen at once, so they pick away at single things. Right now it's the evil assault rifle (whatever that is) next it will be handguns, then sporting rifles and shotguns. They are already talking about eliminating all weapons of war, their definition of this is anything the military uses. Guess what, the military uses handguns, shotguns and bolt action rifles.

Hi Chuck I will do my best to answer your questions.
Can people still possess them? Is there a grandfather type law? Please correct me if I am wrong.
Nope. AR-style weapons are no longer allowed in Canada. They must be locked up and stored while a buy back program is put in place.

Now they are trying to pass a bill for Banning the sales of handguns. I think if you already own one you are "grandfathered" in... but any new purchases are banned.
Yes. New handguns can not be purchased. Existing handguns are exempt, but within the strict rules already in place for storing, transporting and using handguns.

For most Canadians owning guns is a privelidge. I say most because if you are an aboriginal person your treaty rights state that you can use whatever weapon you choose to harvest food for domestic purposes. The Courts have interpreted that to mean Indians, Inuit and Metis can own assault weapons.Interesting eh!

Further, "long guns" are limited to 5 round capacity. Not sure how the firearms people will deal with tubulars magazines on .22's or how they will deal with shotgun capacity considering there are 2" 2.5" 2.75" 3" and 3.5" shells out there.

In Canada we do not "worship" guns. It is not our right and it is not our culture. That said, guns are totally accepted and acceptable when used as a tool by hunters, trappers, farmers, target shooters, etc. etc. etc. I own exactly 4 guns...a .22 Winchester lever action that holds way more than 5 shells, a single shot .270 Winchester for big game, a single shot .410 shotgun for potting grouse and vermin, a a 12 gauge O/U for bird hunting. That is all the guns I need or want I guess. I don't think about it much. They are just guns.

So what do I think is the problem?

1) Guns are too easy to buy in the USA. In Canada you need a Licence to purchase a gun, To get that licence you need to take a firearm course, pass an exam and undergo a detailed background check including possibly contacting your spouse and others seeking information. Then you can purchase and register a weapon..
2) The USA is so divided both politically and socially. Plainsman provided a statement by Pastor Isker that he felt described the American situation accurately. I found the opinon piece to be somewhat hate-filled towards your elected leader and intolerant of others, especially non-Christians. Your elected leader was called "a despicable man, and the legion of sociopathic ghouls arrayed behind him, are clearly overjoyed that there is a classroom full of young children lying dead in Texas" and " You can have a world where things like mass shootings never happen again, but you must devote yourself to a life of repentance, faith, and an unquenchable passion for the true, good, and beautiful things God has given." Is that as long as he is the same God I am worshiping?

The problem goes beyond my comprehension. I have no solution.

Edit: One more thing...I thought the most funniest thing I heard was when "guns were not allowed in the NRA convention when Trump was speaking"...why not arm every single one of the "good guys" there for his speech...Hypocrits!

Canuck we have enough gun laws, but our soft on other crimes judges don't enforce them. If your picked up with cocain and a gun you plead it down to a misdemeanor. If your picked up with a gun in the wrong place, like a political rally and you don't have drugs your in trouble. Intentional or not the democrats are giddy with every shooting. Not long ago a shooting was stopped by a man with a gun. but you don't hear a peep now.
They want background checks. Guess what we have had them for 20+ years. They want to close the gun show loophole. We'll guess what there is no gun show loop hole. They want crime to go down like it did in the last assault weapons ban. We'll guess what the truth is. Studies could not find enough change to document.
We don't worship guns we value freedom. and only worship God. When Trudeau declares himself dictator were going to have to put more border security on our northern border, but only after a couple of years. Leave it open for two years because the cream of the crop will escape first. If they haven't caught on on two years we don't want them. Send us your intelligent and hard working. I'm not being a joker here I am dead seriouse.

Canuck,

Thank you for the clarification and input.

The question I have for you. What is the "course" about that you have to take? What is the exam?

But what you described is exactly what scares most gun owning citizens in the USA. You know the slippery slope aspect of it all.

You talk about the can't hold more than 5 shells. Well... spring snow goose hunters with extended tubes will be illegal. People who shoot or eradicate hogs down in TX, OK, etc for farmers with shot guns and also AR style weapons out of helicopters can't have more than 5 shells??? BTW... Helicopter hunting of hogs has been the best way to help slow the problem. Since they can't legally poison them. Then like you mentioned.... How do they regulate tube style magazines on .22's or shotguns and even some lever action rifles?

But you see what you just described after just 2 years..... they went for more regulations... and more regulations and more regulations.

Now I know that Canada doesn't have a bill of rights so to speak like the USA. What I mean by this is that they dont have the 2nd amendment that we have in the USA... ie: Right to bare arms.

Now I will agree that there is a huge cultural difference when it comes to guns between USA and Canada. But many feel the exact same way as you do...ie: accepted as tools like you mentioned and for the purposes you mentioned. I remember when Canada passed the registration law. I was actually up hunting waterfowl and many of the farmer's were upset with it. Because just like you mentioned they view their guns as a tool. Many talked about the .22 or .243 they had. They said we use them to shoot raccoons, skunks, coyotes, etc. They viewed their guns just like they view a pitchfork or hammer. Now that was about 20 years ago or so. They also mentioned... Well what is next or what will they regulate next. Some were not too worried but others were. They stated just like I always say... It could go bad or the wrong way depending on WHO COMES INTO POWER. Now you are getting the laws you are stating.

Also like you many in the USA don't feel the "need" to own AR's and what not. But they do understand that it could become a slippery slope and the next thing that will be taken is their handguns, hunting rifles, etc.

Canuck.... How do you sell a gun to a neighbor or a friend in Canada? Is there some sort of check or place you have to go to make this transaction happen? Or how about if you want to gift a gun to someone? IE: hand down your O/U to an adult child?


Plainsman.... The biggest LIE or CROCK OF CRAP out there is the whole "gun show loophole". This is so stupid and a lie. All the people who have a table or booth at gun shows and want to sell guns need to have an FFL. PERIOD!!!! The "loophole" is that lets say I am at a gun show. I am at a vendors booth and I hear a guy talking prices for a gun....lets say it is a glock pistol. I hear the price that the vendor quotes the guy ($800). The prospective buyer says... well let me think about it. I then walk up to the prospective buyer and say... Hey I got a glock I am willing to get ride of. I will sell it to you for $700. The guy agrees. So the private party to private party sale wont need a background check. THAT IS WHAT THEY ARE TRYING TO TALK ABOUT WITH THE GUN SHOW LOOPHOLE.

Chuck your right about the pseudo gun show loop hole. The truth as we both know it's no different than selling your gun to a guy down the street from your house.
One thing I notice is we all often get sucked into the
" you don't need 30 rounds to shoot a deer" bs. Then we start debating hunting not realizing we have been sidetracked. The second amendment that our founders gave us was intended as s protection against tyranny. The democrats constantly try crossing that line now, and have often crossed it, but I doubt anyone will do anything about it. We have rotted from the inside. If that was not true Hillary would be behind bars.

The problem is democrats don't respect the constitution, and tyrants hate it. Foreigners don't understand it because they have never tasted freedom and when they want to they expect us to come and win it for them. We have spilled oceans of blood and spent trillions of hard earned dollars for aholes that deserve nothing.

We and much of the world have become so weak that we can not easily tolerate the truth. We hear the tired old cliche " momma said if you can't say anything nice dont say anything at all". Momma was a fool because say nothing and watch what happens to society. In the past we called it peer pressure and it kept society civil. Today the pressure is to ignore everything and the pressure is to shut up and let the crazies do anything.