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So foolish its funny

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So foolish its funny

by Plainsman » Mon Jan 25, 2021 9:59 pm

Now Biden is mandating all gov vehicles must be electric. I missed part if it, but I think they have a couple of years. Can you imagine the expense? How do you charge them? Oh ya fossile fuel power plants or flood wildlife bottom land habitat for more hydroelectricity. Things appear so simple when your stupid.
"Total tolerance is not a virtue, it is a total lack of principles". Plainsman 2016

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Re: So foolish its funny

by Chuck Smith » Tue Jan 26, 2021 8:57 am

So a few things on this one.... some good and some bad.

1. So snow removal will be done by electric vehicles, plows, skids, loaders, dump trucks, etc.... really???
2. So all construction or earth moving done by any gov agency will need electric skids, dumps, backhoes, loaders, etc... really???
3. The cost of getting an electric vehicles to every gov agency.... really... this is side by sides, mowers, cars, trucks, vans, etc???
4. WHERE ARE WE GETTING THIS MONEY FROM?????

Now a few possible good points....
1. Will the fed now sub out all of the snow removal jobs, earth moving jobs, construction jobs, mowing jobs, etc to the private sector? So will it grow the private sector jobs??? Possibly

2. The $15 wage... is they move the jobs to the private sector then the "smaller" jobs or lower end workers wont be getting hired so the min of $15 wage to federal employees is a moot point and was just window dressing EO by Biden.
Last edited by Chuck Smith on Tue Jan 26, 2021 9:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: So foolish its funny

by southdakbearfan » Tue Jan 26, 2021 9:33 am

This will take a long time and there are areas that do not have the infrastructure for it yet.

It doesn’t go beyond the federal fleet, so no snow removal will be affected.

Most private contractors want nothing to do with highway snow removal as it turns a 300,000 mile tandem into a 150,000 mile tandem due to the corrosive salts and plowing stresses.
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Re: So foolish its funny

by Chuck Smith » Tue Jan 26, 2021 9:37 am

It doesn’t go beyond the federal fleet, so no snow removal will be affected.


So they dont remove snow at national parks? They dont remove snow at federal office buildings? they dont remove snow at federal army bases? they dont remove snow at federal prisons? .... etc.

Snow removal will be affected..... skid steers, loaders, dumps, etc.

Lets put it this way... ANYWHERE BIG EQUIPMENT IS USED.... like i will keep stating... Skid steers, dump trucks, mowers, tractors, backhoes, loaders, side by sides, 1 ton trucks, etc.

Also here is another little tidbit... what will it cost? Again not just the conversion of equipment. We all know that a batter powered mower doesn't last as long as a gas one. you need to recharge things... so will federal jobs take longer than before. Yes the simple jobs of mowing or moving snow in a parking lot? So if it takes an extra hour to do a job... and it is a minimum wage job so that is an extra $15 on top of the expenses of conversion? Now is that $15 saved in fuel cost for that one hour? that is the Billion dollar question.
Last edited by Chuck Smith on Tue Jan 26, 2021 9:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: So foolish its funny

by southdakbearfan » Tue Jan 26, 2021 9:42 am

Chuck Smith wrote:
It doesn’t go beyond the federal fleet, so no snow removal will be affected.


So they dont remove snow at national parks? They dont remove snow at federal office buildings? they dont remove snow at federal army bases? they dont remove snow at federal prisons? .... etc.

Snow removal will be affected..... skid steers, loaders, dumps, etc.


99% contracted.
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Re: So foolish its funny

by Chuck Smith » Tue Jan 26, 2021 9:52 am

99% contracted.


Couple things...

1. Are you so sure?
2. So this is just a "fluff" EO?
3. So is this hand in hand with the minimum wage bill for fed employees... a "fluff" order?

SD... I am not trying to pick on you. Because you do recognize that this EO is dumb and will cost alot to convert and will take years to happen.

But I am doing this so anyone who reads does some self thinking about this stuff.
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Re: So foolish its funny

by southdakbearfan » Tue Jan 26, 2021 10:26 am

I think it’s a little of both in being feel good fluff and a direction to the future where a transition to electric vehicles will slowly happen.
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Re: So foolish its funny

by Plainsman » Tue Jan 26, 2021 11:08 am

It doesn’t go beyond the federal fleet, so no snow removal will be affected.
What? You dont think the feds move snow? Where I worked we moved all of our snow, and down the rosd a ways to be good neighbors to the teachers who had rural homes next to our property. We had one military surplus blower that had eight foot tall tires 4x4 with 500 horse power just to run the blower. In one bad blizzard we were authorized as an emergency to clear the airport.
Every National wildlife refuge, Forest Service, BLM facility etc moves its own snow.

No new jkbs will be created because it requires a person fed or private. I have worked with
contracting and it cost double. There was money to experiment with contracting so I jumped on it. I had to deal with a company on tbe east coast to get the expertise I required. They took half and the employee got half. I had to pay that company double so the worker would get the same as the fed employee sitting next to them that was getting $12/hr.

I dont think electric cars will do anhthing for the dnvironment, but only give warm fuzzy feelings to the simple. I have electric heat in my house and they brag about how clean it is. Im not dumb enkugh to not realize that the electricity I get is produced by fossike fuels. The only difference iz rather than burning it in my home the fuel is burned 100 miles away and comes to me by power line.
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Re: So foolish its funny

by southdakbearfan » Tue Jan 26, 2021 11:22 am

Plainsman wrote:
It doesn’t go beyond the federal fleet, so no snow removal will be affected.
What? You dont think the feds move snow? Where I worked we moved all of our snow, and down the rosd a ways to be good neighbors to the teachers who had rural homes next to our property. We had one military surplus blower that had eight foot tall tires 4x4 with 500 horse power just to run the blower. In one bad blizzard we were authorized as an emergency to clear the airport.
Every National wildlife refuge, Forest Service, BLM facility etc moves its own snow.

No new jkbs will be created because it requires a person fed or private. I have worked with
contracting and it cost double. There was money to experiment with contracting so I jumped on it. I had to deal with a company on tbe east coast to get the expertise I required. They took half and the employee got half. I had to pay that company double so the worker would get the same as the fed employee sitting next to them that was getting $12/hr.


Percentage wise on federal property it’s very low. You listed ones that do, there are hundreds of agencies that do not.
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Re: So foolish its funny

by Plainsman » Tue Jan 26, 2021 11:24 am

You said NO SNOW REMOVAL.

You should see the equioment they have in National Parks. They remove snow equivelent to a city.
"Total tolerance is not a virtue, it is a total lack of principles". Plainsman 2016

"Never trust a republican with your PUBLIC LAND. Never trust a democrat with your FIREARMS." Bernie Kuntz 2016

To one who has faith, no explanation is necessary.
To one without faith, no explanation is possible".
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Re: So foolish its funny

by southdakbearfan » Tue Jan 26, 2021 12:36 pm

Plainsman wrote:You said NO SNOW REMOVAL.

You should see the equioment they have in National Parks. They remove snow equivelent to a city.


There also is no option for battery powered plow trucks, snow blowers, truck blowers or the like so I really don’t understand what you are all fired up about.
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Re: So foolish its funny

by Plainsman » Tue Jan 26, 2021 2:02 pm

southdakbearfan wrote:
Plainsman wrote:You said NO SNOW REMOVAL.

You should see the equioment they have in National Parks. They remove snow equivelent to a city.


There also is no option for battery powered plow trucks, snow blowers, truck blowers or the like so I really don’t understand what you are all fired up about.


I simply see it as a president thinking he is doing something for the environment and isn't smart enough to understand that electrical energy isn't free it requires charging and the charging requires and outlet and to power that burn fossil fuels or flood precious river bottom land to get hydroelectric. Here in North Dakota our hydroelectric from Garrison Dam goes to southern Minnesota. Most of our electricity locally comes from coal fired plants that Biden hates. So we get electric cars that need fossil fuels to charge. Burn it in the car or burn it at a power plant 200 miles away what's the difference? I would venture that approximately the same amount of fossil fuel would be required to move a same weight vehicle a mile down the road. If not then someone invented some magic coal that defies the laws of physics.
It's interesting the habitat degradation that occurs around factories producing batteries. It's so bad with so many regulations that large batteries I don't believe are even made in the United States anymore. We have China making those for us. China who isn't held accountable under the Paris Climate Accord that we are rejoining that puts more restrictions on the United States than any other nation. If this is a global problem why punish us and let others off completely????? One would think it on purpose to destroy the American economy. Are we to let our enemies and our competition decide what we can and can not do? This is not only abandoning America first, this is accepting America last.
"Total tolerance is not a virtue, it is a total lack of principles". Plainsman 2016

"Never trust a republican with your PUBLIC LAND. Never trust a democrat with your FIREARMS." Bernie Kuntz 2016

To one who has faith, no explanation is necessary.
To one without faith, no explanation is possible".
~Thomas Aquinas
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Re: So foolish its funny

by Chuck Smith » Tue Jan 26, 2021 2:28 pm

There also is no option for battery powered plow trucks, snow blowers, truck blowers or the like so I really don’t understand what you are all fired up about.


THAT IS MY POINT.... this is a "fluff" EO. But yet it is REGULATING us to death.

Now people say that the "extremes" are not the party. Which part of the Dem's are pushing this "green" the hardest. Isn't it the "EXTREMES".... so right now the "extremes" are actually getting some policy done. They are the ones who pushing Biden to do things. Which side is caving into the "extreme" side of their party? Where does this stop?
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